Gallagher is the first guest to ever walk out on Marc in the middle of an interview. You'll hear how it got to that point as the famed watermelon-smasher defends his original brand of comedy (said watermelon-smashing) and his recent strain of on-stage bon mots (which have come under fire for racist and homophobic undertones). This episode is sponsored by AdamandEve.com - click here for the special Valentine's Day WTF offer.
who made him the pc joke arbiter?
he's had countless other guests who have racially charged
material. i've never heard him take any of them to task.
isn't it all about how you frame things (lisa lampanelli)?
singling out gallagher is some fucking weak sauce!
1. Gallagher had a really combative/argumentative style of interviewing right from the beginning - I was getting annoyed with him in the first ten minutes.
2. Marc really got on a soap box for this one. The first amendment lets people say whatever they want on stage. If it has racism or bigotry in it don't buy tickets to his show and he'll reap what he has sown. He said so himself that nobody is calling him offering TV shows - if he was as smart as he thinks he is he would know why.
a)If he didn't write them
b)If it was in the middle of the country where the audience are bigots anyway
Two problems with this:
a)Those people that look up to Gallagher enough to buy his tix are reinforced by a celebrity telling them it's okay to laugh at gays for being born gay. The behavior then continues.
b)If I hear a joke that starts "what do you call 100 niggers at the bottom of the lake..." it's NOT okay to repeat the joke onstage JUST BECAUSE I DIDN'T WRITE IT. Shit, man, it's just puerile.
Gallagher just ducked and avoided a simple question by using the tactic of asking a return question. People that are obviously of mediocre intelligence but refer to themselves as geniuses are bizarre ("you think it's lightning!" Uh. no, Gallagher, I don't, actually)
Marc thought he could keep asking the question instead of changing interview tactics.
Eddie Murphy WAS hammered on for his gay jokes, and he has since expressed regret over them. Dice Clay was telling jokes in character as an obvious misogynist/homophobe (a la Archie Bunker) meant to be laughed AT. Gallagher, on the other hand, was speaking from his cold, hateful heart. You're one of those people has a hard time 'getting' humor, aren't you?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXd-AZrRmyg
50 seconds in. So, tell me how he has changed so much?
There is nothing wrong with his jokes unless there is something wrong with all the other comedians who tell racy jokes. He is an easy target now because he has become sensitive and disconnected/eccentric. He was always smart about his observations. He had hacky comedy AND he had high brow comedy. People should quit being assholes and try to be fair and see things accurately.
I can't think of a more uncomfortable subject to discuss.
But, what (the fuck) was THAT?
I mean, a serious ambush of someone who didn't even understand what a podcast is? What was gained by that? Blindsiding a sold-out, old, has-been comic?
And for what? Because he's telling dated, crass street jokes that he can barely recite, let alone write. And you're trying to bully confession on the grounds of the social stigma you feel he's causing? He barely understands what he's doing, let along what you're accusing him of. How is he supposed to defend it?
For someone who claims to be so anti-bully, you did a great job of being one there.
Do you really feel good about this, Marc?
Gallagher had a heart attack on stage. He will die soon. He doesn't much like the state this country is in these days and I'm sure he'll be out of his misery when he does die.
People should be able to tell any joke they want. If you don't like it, don't go to his show, and don't interview him. Above all, don't lie to him and get him on your show just to treat him as your leftist PC thug punching bag.
It's called if you want a sanitized PC world, only hang around with people with the same views as you and don't try and make the world in your image.
There's no reason to feel sorry for Gallagher here, he knows he's a jerk. There's no excuse for behavior like this, he's clearly old enough to know better than to exacerbate this idiotic behavior. I'm super impressed with Marc, love that he has the balls to call someone out on their shit face to face like this.
I'm Marc's age. I have no idea how old I was when I first started seeing Gallagher on TV all the time (I remember the old Make Me Laugh) and I couldn't stand him. I still don't appreciate his comedy. But... I'll still defend him here. That Stranger review Marc seemed to draw from was so wrong on so many levels it was disappointing Marc took it as gospel. For one thing, it was just one young hipster's view. For another, the writer took jokes as a reflection of what the man "had become". I'm seeing more and more of that lately -- news stories/reviews/gossip items trying to make the claim that someone's act = real life. OMG! Chelsea Handler totally ripped Angelina Jolie! Lisa Lampanelli totally disrespected Zsa Zsa Gabor! Gallagher's right: they're jokes. That's not to argue they're good jokes, but you can't really make the leap from joke to reality. I could see it more if the comic were a socio-political comic rather than a cartoon character who told silly street jokes. There's absolutely no way this aging hippy was making any kind of social/political statement.
As someone else here wrote (I actually read every comment prior to making mine), Adam Carolla is way, way more racist and homophobic. I always liked Carolla from the little I saw of him on talk shows so I gave him podcast a listen on several different occasions. But I won't again and that's because it's hard to separate his hurtful or demeaning comments-masked-as-jokes (they're not thought-out jokes but just shock comments said in conversation) from the man. So, yes, why the double standard? Is it because Gallagher is old and irrelevant? Maybe it's because I, like Marc, am getting up there that I hate hearing younger people dismiss someone just because they're old and not as hip as they used to be.
I also heard Gallagher with older ears. That is, I assumed he was being funny early in the interview in, as someone else said, a Pepitone-esque way.
That being said, I loved the episode. I found myself agreeing with both Gallagher and Marc at different times. I really hope you can patch things up and talk again.
Marc, please continue your efforts at relaxing, because we're gonna need you for the future.
The first part of the interview was interesting. I enjoyed hearing a comic of his generation talk about the Comeday Store and the "comedian Strike" and his thoughts on not having a tv show because he went on the road. Really interesting stuff.
And then.... out of no where, completely left field, you accuse him of being a racist and homophobe. Where the hell did THAT come from. Bill O'Reilly couldn't have done a better job of ambushing someone. And then it was unrelenting. I actually had more respect for him for hanging in there and taking that uncalled for abuse for so long. You really left him no choice but to walk off because you lost your own cool, and you wouldn't even let him respond. Clearly you had an agenda and ruined what could have been a great interview. I would have told you f off long before he did. I admire that he did try and respond for as long as he did. You get an F on this one Marc. It was a sad display and showed absolutely no respect or objectivity at all.
Liked your remarks about Portland, too. It all sounded just about right. I've been here since 1976 -- and I just got hosed from a 28 year career at a "heritage" Portland radio station, so your remarks about the "arc of anyone's career" also had a certain...resonance.
Keep up the good work.
"We were having a good conversation. Awww...c'mon, Gallagher."
?
Brilliant.
George Carlin on left wing paternalism:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8_YL3q1--U
Goddamned entertaining podcast.
What an insane narcissist.
I think Marc did the best he could considering.
I think Marc nailed it on the head at the end.
Gallagher is an old, disconnected, irrelevant, bitter old man.
What a ranting fucktard.
And I was pretty sympathetic to the sort of class of comedian that Gallagher was representing. The kind who not only spend hours thinking what to say, but how to say it, how to perform it for an audience. It does seem like something that's been lost over time, that it's not enough to have ideas, you have to put on a show. I don't necessarily agree with that sentiment, but I can certainly understand how someone can become bitter about society failing to value what they feel they've worked really hard to accomplish.
It's too bad he's got such a chip on his shoulder. He should be happy to have had the time he did and to have made the money he did even if it was only temporary-- instead of using it as fuel for his bitterness furnace.
This interview was so damn funny. Yet really sad at the same time. It sounded like Maron was alternately interviewing a cranky elderly woman and The Joker.
Who knew Gallagher was scared shit of electrons?
If the Gallagher went on the show as a character he truly is a genius comic. If that's his actual personality, he's shit balls crazy.
Were I a comedian of any stripe I would hesitate to be on your show, and I would be totally on gaurd if I were.
Forget Frost-Nixon, make this interview into a movie!
Gallagher is out-of-touch, rich, sad, insecure, unchallenged, and seems to be barely holding life together. I feel for Gallagher and the feeling of being let down over the years but, he has no room to complain. He has been wildly successful and has taken that for granted and sold himself out to any laugh at any cost. I hope this gives him a chance to reflect and change his life and come back. Marc may only know people who thought he was funny to 10 year olds and I may have been one of them (and not for the smashing stuff) but, he was insightful and I can recall learning new perspectives on things when those early specials use to come on in reruns. He was relevant to me, success screwed up his perspective, maybe now reality can fix it.
Instead he just tried to shout Marc down. I give Marc credit for remaining as calm for as long as he did before he too had to resort to raising his voice.
I was actually interesting hearing Gallagher's philosophy on comedy and I agree you can make fun of anything in comedy. The difference is Gallagher does it using base, elementary 'jokes' and as stated in an above comment, just presents a stereotype instead of crafting an actual joke. Sure some people like that, but people like a lot of terrible things. Including Gallagher.
Marc, you forced a subject on him when both of you couldn't come to an agreement about it instead of dropping the subject. Before Gallagher leaves, the interview has turned into a clusterfuck.
And I am not saying this as any Gallagher fan or whatever but you fucked up this time. He is not known as an insult comic or famous for his racial/homo-oriented material.
I imagine an interview with Joan Rivers would sound about the same as this one does. ("They're drinking!" "They're laughing!" "What's the problem?") Marc comes out of recovery and therapy culture. From what he said, Gallagher comes out of boozy nightclub culture (or would like to present himself that way). I don't know enough about comedy history to know if his claim is legitimate, or just a convenient cover.
Homophobic is a weird term that I don't think really applies to Gallagher's 7th grade sex comedy lines. I'd like to go back and listen to the exact lines, but I think the essence of Gallagher's jokes were specifically referring to sex acts in a silly way more than in a fearful or hateful way.
I'd like to see another interview where you guys kiss and make up.
"I've listened every episode of WTF and no one you've interviewed, not even Carlos Mencia is as un-selfaware as Gallagher."
Ummm... Let's not get crazy.
But based on what I've heard in the L.A. comedy community (and I live/work here) the WTF interview might have broken Ned, which is outstanding. He is some sort of drug/alcohol fiend now.
At THE TIME he had zero self-awareness and 100% defense mechanisms, though.
Why not get Doug Stanhope, Frankie Boyle or Ricky Gervais in to talk about the merits of offensive comedy?
You're a big fish. You shouldn't be fighting minnows.
For an alternate view on offensive comedy see: Doug Stanhope's recent article: http://www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/comment/guest-commentary/doug-stanhope-on-offensive-comedy-1.1083012
did he just admit to plagiarism? how pathetic!!
-draydin the damned one
He's got that same idiotic tendency to contradict himself and turn questions towards him back at Maron, sort of like Charles Manson's attempts to twist every bit of logic his way with nonsensical arguments.
What a sad, bitter little man.
Also, I think the Craig Marquardo he mentions is the same meglomaniacal clown who's made spectacular claims of fame and fortune in Portland and the host of the dubious and thoroughly useless Portland Music Awards.
http://www.gallaghersmash.com/
I happened across this old article about Gallagher that provides some interesting tidbits:
http://articles.latimes.com/1988-04-28/entertainment/ca-2908_1_gallagher-projects
Maybe the Carolla interview yesterday gave you some new listeners.
Anyway, my two cents... I agree with someone above who wished you would have just let Gallagher dig his own grave. You did jump on him in a way you haven't with past guests. It appears Gallagher was last minute, you never thought of interviewing him, maybe didn't care to, weren't prepared and just kind of wanted to get it over with and leave Portland.
I don't think you did anything terrible, it's just not the way you've approached past interviews... He was being condescending and acting as if he were THE elder-statesman of "comedy," but I think most of your listeners saw through that shit which alone kind of came off sad.
Yes, I bought the WTF IPhone app and pay the annual fee... I'm entitled to voice criticism... not like some of these other freeloaders. People, pay Marc already! At least buy a fuckin' coffee mug or something.
Come on.... Listen to a few of his shows and then have an opinion. Most people here think you are VERY wrong on that.
Dick
If he is a bigot and a racist, then fuck him. But he probably isn't, he's just a confused member of the old guard, struggling to keep up with an enlightened America, and pandering to those that remain in the dark, the panto crowd. And, if I'm right, then I say give him another bite of the Maron apple, because from what I've now read about the guy, his story would be a fascinating one to hear.
He came in doing his act, left angry, but somewhere in the middle was a nugget of gold.
Still loved this half an interview. Thanks for having the guts to release something that failed - 'warts an' all'. Another great episode Marc!
To be fair, you addressed this in the opening of the episode so you reclaim your cred. You have enough introspection to grant that you might have been a little hard on your subject. I can't really say the same for Gallagher: sorry, but you NEVER walk out on an interview. I was super pissed AT him, FOR him. But you handled Mencia and Williams better than this.
What do I know, though? I still love the show and would rather have the 'human' Marc than a scripted Marc.
No one is going to stop you from telling whatever jokes you want, but you have to at least understand that, just as a dude with a microphone that people are there to see, you have a presence and influence on the large cultural conversation we are having. So you do with that power what you will; some people will reinforce stereotypes, some people will make fun of stereotypes. Comedians can do what they want, but don't be surprised when people call you a bully when you're being a bully.
And I'm so sick of comedians like Gallagher trying to point to double standards like, "Why can black comedians make fun of middle class white males?!"
Because middle class white males are fine! Reinforcing stereotypes about their middle class-ness is not going to affect them, especially since whiteness as an identity gets treated with much more individuality in our society. Middle class white males do not have a context of historical oppression to deal with. There is no history of dehumanizing middle class white males that gets invoked when someone tells those jokes.
So if people in power can't make fun of people not in power, whether it be race or gender or class or disability, maybe on a technical sense that's a double standard. But in a human sense, it doesn't really matter, does it?
What was with the whole defender of the gays and Arabs routine? Is Maron now some comedic arbiter who gets to decide what topics,groups,etc are acceptable to make fun of. By Marc's logic gays and arabs should be off limits for Gallagher but he can make fun of the same old tired stereotype of southern Christians who ride Jesus ponies, which is done by every bi-coastal comedian. By his own standards Marc is a hypocrite. If your going to put standards on Gallagher just be consistant with your own.
I agree.
He's a nut but it would have been a much better interview if Marc had stepped back and just talked to him like he did Mencia. Let him explain himself and have the confidence to let the audience judge the result.
By the way, on the specific subject of the alleged homophobic and racist jokes, I would wager on Carolla being on Gallagher's side. I can hardly imagine Carolla saying something like, "Why do you have to do jokes that hurt people's feelings?" (paraphrase)
You both at some point both became equally antagonistic to each other, but Gallagher seemed like a Sunday morning TV evangelist. I just hear him hiding behind the title of being "a comic" that justifies his loose tongue. He is pretty immature, going as low to the point of mocking you in a childish tone.
I'm sure he is a great guy though; under another situation.
Also at JohnH, Marc has no idea who you are either nor will care about your narrow minded view on comedy.
Make sure he's not waiting for you with the hammer ...at night....
Comedians make fun of everybody and everything. You do not know that and that is why you will never go anywhere in comedy.
If you are going to attack someone based on their material, I feel that you should first do your homework and be familiar with the material in question. As much as it pains me to say, Gallagher was right to take issue with the fact that your criticism was based on second-hand information.
I also found it frustrating that on the few occasions that Gallagher raised some genuinely interesting points, they were mostly ignored. For example, I would have loved some followup to the idea that the sledgehammer bit started out as a piece of satire on consumer culture, only to later become the only idiotic shtick he is known for.
On another note, how is it OK to make fun of the ignorance of, say, people who don't understand evolution or global warming, while being ignorant of even more fundamental scienticic facts (such as the difference between a photon and an electron)? This is not meant as a personal attack as much as commentary on how ignorance of basic science has become socially acceptable except on a few politically charged topics.
By the way, I saw you on Conan and that's how I found out about this. I LOVE your podcast, man. I'm at the point with talk shows like Conan that when it comes time for the meaningless banter in the second half I reach for the remote. For some reason with you I didn't. That must be a good sign. Your "getting dressed while running through a time machine" was hilarious. Anyhew, your interviews at WTF are fascinating and insightful. I actually feel as if I come away from them having learned something. I don't know if it's because these guys just feel that perhaps a lot of people aren't listening (no offense, just a theory), or that you really can draw out personal details from your guests that they dont reveal on other shows.
One thing I enjoy about listening to two comedians chatting is that there's no attempt at bullshit. It's like you both know that the other is going to call it as soon as he senses it, or poke fun at it, so everything is just laid on the line. But as we saw with Gallager (no fuckin clue how to spell that) it doesn't always end well. Personally, even though I agreed with you, I think you needled him a bit too long with the homophobic questions. Once you reduced him to choked silence, which you did at one point, you should have moved on. With that said, it didn`t seem as if the conversation was heated enough for him to walk off. That was lame.
Anyway, I`ve drolled on too long here. Great podcast. All the best.
He seemed really intent on making sure you understood how "right" he was, and it seemed like his way of deciding he was understood was to cajole you into agreeing with his "rightness." I don't blame you for exhibiting a very human anxiety when he tried to make you complicit in his opinions.
-Maron
Check out Gallagher's Twitter feed (@realgallagher) and see how often he calls things "faggy." There's no thought behind his jokes, no twist, no irony, nothing except mindless offensive slurs for things he doesn't like. He's bitter because his schtick-based comedy went out with Hammer pants and the world has left him behind.
Second best - 40:01 "I understand gays better than I do Arabs." Are you trying to tell us something Gallagher?
Gallagher seemed to touch a nerve when he said "Comedy is not thearpy." Otherwise he sounds like he is slightly losing he mind. Of course I would go a little loony if my own brother was pretending to be me and making money off of it. Pretty sad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAfhm0F-594
In light of your great interview I feel I should share this with you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9a5fOYe7rA
behold our nihilistic future
My thoughts exactly.
Wow, dude. Just wow. I could go off, but it's already sad enough.
I thought your opening bit to this podcast was really perceptive. The Gallagher interview itself didn't shed much light on the bigger questions, or on the subject himself - except that he sounds extremely old and extremely under-informed, like my grandfather. Did he look particularly haggard?
Also, it was only a few seconds, but he definitely does not understand cell phone radiation, and I have a very hard time imagining he has met with any physics departments in any technical capacity. Cell phones emit low-level microwave radiation that doesn't damage DNA in any way.
How about some respect for a guy who the #1 comedian in America for over a decade? How about some respect for someone who reached heights none of us will ever reach? How about some respect for a guy STILL out there making more than many of us combined?
SOMEONE is buying tickets to his show. Many, many someones in fact - including me.
I understand what Marc wanted to say and do. But he worded it in a way that was accusing him of being homophobic and right wing, instead of taking point with individual jokes.
Mr. Maron, how many hour-long tv specials do you have? How many millions have you made with your comedy?
Is he the same Gallagher from 30 years ago? I would hope not. Are we the same?
Perspective, respect and admiration....no?
Who the fuck wants to play state fairs?
-everyone.
My instinct said Sandler, but Stewart would also make sense.
That's too bad, Marc, but don't let it get you down.
LMAO
"Free food is always fun food"
"Forgiveness is fucking hard"
<3
You gonna kick Pat Cooper in the balls next?
Here's what I think: Gallagher's a fucking asshole. To me, it sounded like he came in with more than one chip on his shoulder, and when you addressed them honestly, he got progressively more condescending to you.
Of course, I'll admit my bias for you, Marc, but man, does this put a portion of my childhood in new perspective. Just like Ray Stevens all over again.
Love ya, Marc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31JybfT97Us
I would have thought Marc could have calmed him down by telling him that if he's so bitter that he's not as big anymore at least at one time he was "Gallagher" and was a pretty big thing, during all that Marc has been working along all this time making a living but without the BIG hit (yet)... and he's seems to accept that it's ok - just part of the business. So to get snappy with Marc might be barking up the wrong tree (so to speak).
I'd REALLY like to see a rematch here and I bet that if you can convince him to come back it would be much calmer and with a happier ending (well hopefully not that kind of happy ending but you know what I mean :-) )..
I'd hate to see this be the end of the discussion with Gallagher,
Good work again Marc.
Dick
Too bad Gallagher sounds like he's completely disconnected with reality.
Great interview...wow.
You asked, "What is to be brought away from this?" For me, it's the impression that Gallagher is a washed-up douchebag with an over-developed sense of self-entitlement. He feels like the world owes him something. Fuck that guy.
Fan fucking tastic. Awesome. You rock, Marc.
Good work Marc.